filters

[leonsmith]

Hello all well i have a juwel vision 450ltr tank at the moment i have the internal filter in there and a jbl 1500 external was sitting looking in the tank thinking i dont really like the internal being in there taking up space etc, was wondering if i should take it out and replace with another external?? will it be overkill if i have 2? would like to take it out but dont want to do so if its too much water flow etc for the fis. I have 1 rusty plec, 4 baby phantoms and a pair of swordtails in there at the moment untill i go to wildwoods saturday

[matthewfaulkner]

You can never have too many filters. If you think there is too much flow you can always redirect or reduce it.

[MatsP]

The Juwel filter may not win any beauty contests, but compared to other internal filters, it's high on the scale of "works well".

It can be removed, but if you have only one external filter, I'd say keep the internal one.

--
Mats

[DJ-don]

taking out the juwel vision filter is very annoying
its better to keep it in there
the internal filter is actually a really good bio filter. it even says on its website we slow down the flow rate for great biological action or something like that

i would say the external is good for mechanical and the juwel vision filter is good for bio
just my thooughts

[leonsmith]

Okey thats for the replys think i will leave it in there then, i must admit i did see a big change in the water when i hooked up the external filter thou, the only thing thats bothering me a bit is the water still seems a little cloudy, all the levels are fine i do a 30% water change every week, what could be causing the cloudyness guys?

[MatsP]

Depends on "what kind of cloudiness". All forms are caused by particles in the water, obviously, but there are all manner of different particles that can be in the water column for a number of reasons. The most obvious ones are algae caused by lots of light, bacterial bloom due to ammonia in the water or microbes that feed on excess of fish-food. Or perhaps the gravel is not clean and the fish are stirring it up... There are certainly more option, but these are the most common, in my experience.

You can also have muck from a filter escaping out into the tank, if your filter is very dirty (or you mess with it).

In general, water changes don't fix cloudy water in itself. It may affect the CAUSE of the cloudiness - e.g. excessive food available getting sucked up.

Of course, adding second filter increases the capacity to suck up any particles and capture them in the filter. This is part of "mechanical filtration".

By the way, I don't agree completely with DJ-don's statement that the external filter has better capacity for mechanical and less biological filtration. I'd say that this depends on what filter media is in the two filter systems. The sponges in the Juwel filter is generally good for both mechanical and biological, but they do clog up after a bit. External filters come with a set of filter media, some have sponges, others use ceramic media or plastic ("bio-balls" etc). The ceramic/plastic media is often in two different types: A mechanical form to capture and hold coarse particles (e.g. Eheim EhfiMech aka "Ceramic macaroni", and a biological form, such as Eheim EhfiSubstrat which is small lumps/balls that have a porous surface that can be home to the good bacteria that is doing the biological filtration.

There is also "floss" or "polishing media", which is normally the last filtration stage. This is a "fine particle filter", which removes any small particles and make the water crystal clear [at least, that's the theory].

A filter with a bigger filter media capacity will allow a greater range of filter media, and the mix of biological and mechanical filtration can be adjusted to match the needs of that particular tank.

--
Mats

[leonsmith]

Okey thanks for that mats, i did change the top white part of the filter last week, it was very dirty oops .The external filter i put micro mec in the bottom tray and the ceramic stones in down the middle, so theres plenty of breeding space for the bacteria. like i said all my levels are fine. I might be feeding them to much its hard to know what there eating, the sword tails are fine they start to munch the second i put the flakes in, but the rusty plec and the 4 little phantoms dont eat the tabs straight away or dont see them at all and have noticed they do disintgrate . so dont actually know who is eating what or how much.

[Richard B]

I might be feeding them to much its hard to know what there eating, ............................the rusty plec and the 4 little phantoms dont eat the tabs straight away or dont see them at all and have noticed they do disintgrate . so dont actually know who is eating what or how much.

This isn't ideal as picky or sensitive plecos will be first to suffer if water quality starts to deteriorate, causing them to not feed.

it might be worth a period of observation after the next water change. like miss a couple of days feeding, then add some tabs & watch for an hour or so. Or maybe a chunk or courgette or similar so their feeding volumes can be estblished & foodstuffs offered can be adjusted accordingly. additionally a wide variety of foodstuffs should be offered as their favourites can quickly be determined & fed in greater quantities, or greater frequency of other foods which are less favoured & present the possibility of deterioration in the tank