Gel food diet...good or bad?

[luver_of_fish]

I have been meaning to ask about the gel food diet I have been feeding all of my fish lately. They all love it, but I don't really know if it is good for all of them. The reason I am worried is because of the protien content of this diet (from fish, egg and veggie sources) for my plecos.

Here are the links to different information about this diet and the particular recipe I made up (it contains canned salmon, poached egg white, several veggies, cooked white rice, paprika and Acidophilus).

http://thegab.org/Articles/GoldfishNutrition2.html

http://dataguru.org/misc/aquarium/Food.html

The recipe I used (I chose this one becuase my goldies are not too old yet, perhaps a year and a half to 2 years old, and I know goldies can live to be quite old so I figured this is young for them):

http://dataguru.org/misc/aquarium/GelHiProtein.html

I didn't plan on feeding this to my plecos when I originally started this diet (about a week ago for my goldfish, betta and BN and about 5 days ago for my tropical community tank and my L083 and L104). The thing is they seem to just devour it. I haven't actually seen my L083 or L104 eating it, but the L104 hasn't seemed to be eating his drift wood as much and I noticed him really picking along the gravel shortly after feeding everyone the gel food and I have noticed large poops floating (so am assuming they belong to L083 because of the size) and they never used to do that too much before. FYI, I made some of this food into the floating version because I thought the tropicals and the betta would be able to eat it better, but it actually hasn't floated and sinks slowly to the bottom just like the other. I have noticed the tropicals have seemed to figured this new food out and eat it fine as it is falling and then off the plants and gravel once it has all fallen. I have continued to put in Hikari algea wafers and summer squash in each tank at night before turning in. I house the L083 and L104 in my 55 gallon tank and the squash is always well eaten and the algea tabs are gone each morning. The BN in my 27 gallon tank never seems to eat the squash and I try to break up the algea tabs in several pieces so he at least gets a couple because the goldies eat it too and I have watched him eat this. I worry about the BN though because I read a high protien diet is bad and I've also read the algea tabs aren't good for the goldies (bouancy issues). I wonder if the BN would be better off in the 55 gallon tank, but also worry about putting him in there as I have just finshed a course of treatment for ick a couple days ago. I worry about the L083 and L104 because of the protien content as well and the floating poop (possible bloat/gas issues). Am also wondering if this is really a suitable diet for the tropicals.

I was also considering using the Mazuri gel food diet, but don't know if they would be better (perhaps using the herbivore diet for the plecos, of couse I don't know how to get them to eat only their food and the other fish to eat only their food ).

https://www.mazuri.com/Home.asp?Products=2

I also noticed there is a Pro-Tec gel diet available. I found it mentioned a couple of times on different threads on this forum.

http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... 7&start=20

http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... =5&t=24481

http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... &sk=t&sd=a

Any suggestions? Has anyone else tried gel food diets? Finally, I just get so confused about food in general when it comes to all of my pets (dog, cats and fish). I want to do the best I can within my budget for all of them and it seems so many commerical foods are just junk! I'm not sure if it is the same for fish food. According to the site I linked above, it is. Maybe I just worry too much...

[Mike_Noren]

Haven't tried those, but "shrimp mix" is a very popular food in Europe, especially for herbivorous fish. The basic recipe is 50% shrimp, 50% frozen green peas, vitamins, mixed until smooth, set with gelatin or agar, then frozen in e.g. icecube trays. Works well, and can be varied to taste with e.g. fish or mussel meat, garlic, astaxanthine...

So... yeah, I'm sure it works. If it's The Optimal Food(tm) or whatever depends on what goes in to the food and how it's treated and stored.

EDIT: I guess what I'm saying is making your own food for your fish will no doubt result in great food, and that fish are nowhere near as sensitive as feed manufacturers would have you believe.

[luver_of_fish]

Well, they do have this other gel food recipe which is actaully pretty easy, but I am not so sure about it's nutritional content either. Some of the recipes say you can add 1 Tab multivitamin (OneSource, Multivitamin-Multimineral Adult High Potency Formula) for added nutrition.

Here is the link for more nutritional breakdown information. http://dataguru.org/misc/aquarium/GelBabyPeas.html

Makes about 5 ounces of gel food.

Ingredients:

Ingredients
1 Pack Unflavored Gelatine
1 Tbsp Water (bottled, filtered/dechlorinated)
2 Sardines (about 1/4 of a 3.75 ounce can)
1 jar Babyfood peas (no sugar or salt added)
1 Tab Lactobacillus Acidophilus optional**

Place the Acidophilus tab in 1 T water to soak. You may need to use a spoon to crush it so it dissolves totally.

Finely chop sardines and mix with babyfood peas in a microwave container and bring to a boil.

Stir in gelatine and stir until dissolved.

After mixture has cooled down to where it's warm, stir in Acidophilus mixture and stir until well mixed.

Pour into a flat dish. Gel should be about 1/4" thick.

Refrigerate until set.

Cut into squares. I leave out no more than a week's worth of gel in a plastic zipper bag and store in the refrigerator. The rest I freeze between layers of plastic wrap. When frozen, I store in the freezer in ziplock bags (each holding about a week of food).

Nutritional Breakout per 10 grams food
54% Protein (1.1 grams)
10% Fat (0.21 grams)
5% Ash (0.1 grams)
31% Carbohydrate (0.6 grams) [8% Fiber (0.2 grams), 13% Sugars (0.3 grams), 10% Complex (0.2 grams)]

6.6 Calories per 10 g food

[luver_of_fish]

I posted a thread on this forum a few days ago, but have only had one reply. I noticed several folks have looked, so I am wondering if no one has any experience with gel food/homemade diets. Here is the link to the previous thread http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... =5&t=25388 [Mod edit: This post was posted separately - the link here is to THIS thread itself --Mats]

If anyone has any advice they can offer, even if it is that they have never tried it, I would like to know. I want to do what is best for my fish, but I don't want to hurt them either.

Thanks

P.S. If I'm just being too impatient I'm sorry. I noticed that my previous post is about to disappear off the first page and I'm afraid I won't get any answers if it does.

[andywoolloo]

Sorry I didn't answer before but I haven't tried making gel food ever, because none of mine liked the pre made gel foods bought from the fish store.

But I agree with Mike, it sounds like the greatest healthiest thing to make your own fish food. Good job!

[luver_of_fish]

Thank you for your repies. I have never tried the commercial gel food, but all my fish absolutely love this homemade stuff. Do you think the protein content is OK for the plecos?

[Birger]

Do you think the protein content is OK for the plecos?

One of the benefits of this kind of food is the protein or vegetable content can be customized to the dietary requirement of a particular species...not all pleco's require the same diet.

What you have to do is figure out the requirements of each species...as an example I have both

Ancistrus cf_cirrhosus

and

Ancistrus ranunculus

I would mix a higher protein content to be used for the ranunculus than used for the other.

Birger

[Chrysichthys]

I suppose you could increase the fibre content by adding some bran or rolled oats.

[MatsP]

If you REALLY feel the need to bump a post, please post a comment in the original thread - particularly, if you want further answers to a PARTICULAR question, post that question in the existing thread.

It also helps to get an answer if you have clear, specific questions, rather than a long essay with a fairly open-ended question at the end. Sorry, I don't mean to be grumpy, but it is my experience that short, distinct questions are generally far more often answered than long posts with lots of reading to be done - I guess many internet users are fairly lazy.

As I saw your original thread, I didn't feel much need to comment, as Mike had already said all that needed to be said: Homemade food is probably the best, because you can vary it depending on the needs of the fish.

I'm merging this thread with the other thread.

--
Mats

[Haavard Stoere]

Apart from various dry foods that suit the particular pleco I intend to feed, I use whole unprocessed food items. Whole unprocessed food for carnivorous plecos are shrimp, fish, mussels and peas. For aufwuchs/algae eaters I use a large number of suitable unprocessed vegetables.

If the ingredients are of good quality you can of course mix ingredients and make frozen/gel foods. Ingredients must be right for the particular specie.

Wood eaters like L104 have very special requirements. They should ideally have several kinds of wood available. Especially softer woods. When given enough of the right wood they show little interest in other food items.

[luver_of_fish]

I have 2 medium sized pieces of Mopani wood and one other piece of driftwood that I found at the LFS. It was labled as driftwood for a terrarium, but when I was soaking it it sank straight away. The L104 still eats the gel food though.

I do have a couple of young apple trees I had to cut down last summer because the rabbits killed them. I also have a cherry tree I cut down that died because of gophers. Darn rodents! They are still outside and I could cut some branches off of them. The roots are still buried and I suppose I could try to dig those out (I read that fishes really like the root system). What would I need to with any of these branches or roots to make sure they are safe for the tank?



P.S.

If you REALLY feel the need to bump a post, please post a comment in the original thread - particularly, if you want further answers to a PARTICULAR question, post that question in the existing thread.

Sorry, I didn't even think when I did that. I forgot if I posted my real need for advice in the original thread it would be bumped back to the top of the page. Duh... Sorry again.

[MatsP]

Preparing wood sourced from anywhere reasonably dry (anything that is not from a river/lake) for a tank mainly involves some mild cleaning (brush off anything loose) and then soaking it until it sinks (or, if you prefer, just stick it in the tank and make sure it stays down with some rocks or such - just beware that it may take some "effort" to hold down larger stuff, and you will want to make sure it's fish-safe).

Bas Pels suggests just putting the wood floating in the tank - that will work, but it will obviously go anywhere it likes unless there is something holding it in place.

If the wood came out of water, it may harbour parasites, so a bit more thorough cleaning, such as boiling it or putting it in the dishwasher (with NO powder/rinse).

--
Mats

[luver_of_fish]

Thanks MatsP!

[apistomaster]

I collect my wood from regional rivers and try to find pieces already water logged or part way there.
The method I'm using to hold down the large pieces that want to float is to wedge a length of 1/4 inch diameter wood dowels transversely so the dowels hold the wood in place. This method doesn't detract much from the over all aquarium aesthetics.
I use a wire brush to clean the wood then a scrub brush and full strength bleach. Even so, some wood will develop some fungal growth. It is transitory but eventually the fungus stops growing.

In my case, rodents are my friend as all the wood I collect has been felled and neatly trimmed and cleaned by the Beavers.

[luver_of_fish]

It is too bad the rodents here (the gophers mainly) have caused me so many problems. The rabbits I can handle, I just put up some fencing. The gophers on the other hand have felled over 20 of my trees. I love all critters though and have even had guinea pigs, mice, hamsters and rats.

Thanks for the wood tips.

[huffmagx]

I make gel food for my fish all the time and they love it! I use a variety of protein and veggies in the mix and vary it all the time. I make some with gelatin and some with agar as the binding agent they both work but I think the agar holds together better at the warmer temps my plecos like to live in.

I have tried the retail gel mixes and they like them also but I prefer to make my own so I know exactly what is in there. I don't feed gel food every day but vary with other commercially prepared feeds and blanched veggies.